Not to Forgive, but to Understand

A podcast series discussing topics in genocide studies with scholars and individuals deeply involved in understanding the complexities of genocide and its perpetrators. Presented by writer, and scholar of Genocide Studies Sabah Carrim, along with co-host Luis Gonzalez-Aponte. Tune in to this podcast series for insightful discussions on pressing topics in the field.

Not to Forgive, but to Understand is a education podcast hosted by Sabah Carrim and Luis Gonzalez-Aponte, with 44 episodes on record and a Required Pod Score of 80. PitchCentric scores this show on Booking Probability, Listen Score, and live audience signals refreshed every 24 hours.

Sabah Carrim and Luis Gonzalez-Aponte hosts Not to Forgive, but to Understand, a education show with 44 episodes published.

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  Not to Forgive, but to Understand

  Emilie Caspar: Just Following Orders: The Brain Science of Obedience, and Obedience to Authority

  Jul 21, 202656 min

  Emilie Caspar is an associate professor at Ghent University and leader of the Moral and Social Brain Lab. Her book Just Following Orders: Atrocities and the Brain Science of Obedience examines obedience, responsibility, and harm under authority. This conversation discusses neuroscience, perpetrator behavior, rescuer behavior, and the phenomenon of obedience to authority. Not to Forgive, but to Understand, hosted by Sabah Carrim, examines genocide and mass atrocity through discussions with scholars, journalists, artists, and other stakeholders. 00:00 Opening 01:43 Introduction 02:08 Why neuroscience in genocide studies? 04:01 “Just following orders” and obedience to authority 08:45 Neuroscience, psychology, and legal defenses 13:52 Responsibility, explanation, and excuse 17:17 Awareness as prevention 19:51 How neuroscience research is conducted 22:34 Portable EEG and field research in Rwanda 28:44 Neurohype and public misunderstanding 31:49 Caspar’s next book and research on rescuers 34:42 What neuroscience adds to genocide studies 38:11 Neuroscience evidence in court 42:16 Skepticism toward neuroscience explanations 44:47 Phineas Gage and causality 46:25 Understanding as prevention 50:47 Milgram, resistance, and rescuers 52:56 Research access and current political violence 55:14 Closing

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  Not to Forgive, but to Understand

  Kate English & Kim Klett: Holocaust Education, Human Rights, and the Right to Learn

  Jun 26, 202646 min

  We speak with Kate English and Kim Klett of the Educators Institute for Human Rights (EIHR), an organization that works with teachers internationally to develop resources and training in Holocaust, genocide, human rights, and conflict education. We discuss what responsible genocide education requires in classrooms and post-conflict settings, including teacher training, accessible educational materials, student engagement, Holocaust education mandates in the United States, and EIHR’s work with the Right to Learn Coalition. Kate and Kim also reflect on the challenges educators face when teaching difficult histories and the role education can play in prevention, reconstruction, and civic life. Learn more about EIHR: https://eihr.org/ Not to Forgive, but to Understand, Hosted by Sabah Carrim and Luis Gonzalez-Aponte examines genocide, mass violence, and their aftermath through conversations with scholars, practitioners, survivors, and others working to understand how these events occur and what their legacies demand of us. 00:00 Opening 02:00 Introducing Kate English and Kim Klett 03:10 EIHR’s Work in Rwanda and the Teacher Corps 09:42 Creating Resources for Educators 14:30 Why Genocide Education Matters After Conflict 19:39 Teacher Constraints and Teaching Difficult Histories 25:07 Holocaust Education Mandates in Arizona 28:12 The Right to Learn Coalition 33:42 Teacher Restrictions, Book Bans, and Classroom Climate 38:01 Fear and Access to Inclusive Education 40:01 EIHR’s Current Work in the Democratic Republic of Congo 42:00 Webinars, Literature, and Learning From Young People in Conflict

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  Not to Forgive, but to Understand

  Judi Rever: Rwanda, Congo, Burundi, and Politically Protected Violence

  Jun 8, 20261h 31mS0

  <p>Investigative journalist Judi Rever joins us to discuss her work on Rwanda, Congo, and the Great Lakes region. Drawing from her books *In Praise of Blood: The Crimes of the Rwandan Patriotic Front* and *Rwanda’s 30-Year Assault on Congo: The Crimes, the Criminals and the Cover-Up*, Rever examines contested histories of violence, regional war, impunity, and international complicity. The conversation also reflects on her career investigating politically protected violence and the risks involved in pursuing difficult historical truths.<br/><br/>Judi Rever’s new book, *Rwanda’s 30-Year Assault on Congo*:<br/>https://www.barakabooks.com/catalogue/rwandas-30-year...

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  Not to Forgive, but to Understand

  Edward Westermann: Thirst, Dehydration, and Water Sanitation in the Holocaust

  May 25, 20261h 15mS0

  <p>Edward Westermann is the Theodore Zev and Alice R. Weiss HEF Chair in Holocaust Studies and Visiting Professor in the Department of History at Northwestern University. He is the author of Drunk on Genocide: Alcohol and Mass Murder in Nazi Germany, which received the 2023 Yad Vashem International Book Prize for Holocaust Research.<br/><br/>In this conversation, Professor Westermann discusses his research on thirst, water deprivation, sanitation, disease, and embodied suffering in the Holocaust. The interview considers how dehydration shaped prisoner experience in camps and transports, how water scarcity intersected with starvation and illness, and how control over water...

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  Not to Forgive, but to Understand

  Mahi Ramakrishnan: Refugees, Rights, and the Rohingya in Malaysia

  May 4, 202658 minS0

  <p>The plight of the Rohingya remains under-addressed in public discourse, even as the genocide case brought by The Gambia against Myanmar continues before the International Court of Justice.<br/><br/>In this interview, we speak with Mahi Ramakrishnan, an investigative journalist, filmmaker, and founder of Beyond Borders Malaysia, about refugees in Malaysia, the legal and political barriers they face, and her use of film, advocacy, and the Festival on Wheels to build public understanding and community connection.<br/><br/>00:00 Opening / Content Note<br/>02:29 Introduction<br/>03:12 Rohingya Refugees in Kuala Lumpur<br/>04:44 From Investigative Journalism to Beyond Borders Malaysia<br/>11:32...

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