The Grown UP Business Podcast

The Grown Up Business Podcast is a scale-up podcast for entrepreneurs, founders, and CEOs who want proven strategies for scaling a business sustainably and building companies that work without them. Hosted by Paul Avins , Business Transformation Expert, this podcast draws on over 21 years of coaching experience , supporting 20,000+ entrepreneurs and helping facilitate £150m+ in business exits . Each episode Paul shares practical insights, disciplined leadership thinking, and real-world scale-up frameworks to help founder and CEOs find new levels of personal and professional performance. On the podcast, you’ll hear: Expert Interviews Candid conversations with successful founders, CEOs, investors, and subject-matter experts covering leadership, scaling, funding, operations, exits, wellbeing and p

The Grown UP Business Podcast is a business podcast hosted by Paul Avins, with 62 episodes on record and a Required Pod Score of 80. PitchCentric scores this show on Booking Probability, Listen Score, and live audience signals refreshed every 24 hours.

Paul Avins hosts The Grown UP Business Podcast, a business show with 62 episodes published.

Our AI reads these to draft pitches. Use them as grounding for a pitch that cites a real guest and a specific topic.

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  Episode #30

  Stop Hustling, Start Leading: The Psychology Behind Scaling Beyond $10M - Deborah Henley

  Aug 7, 20261h 45mS2

  Why does the same approach that got you to $5m stop working past $10m? Because at that point the constraint isn't the business anymore. It's you. In this episode, Paul Avins sits down with Deborah Henley, author of Your Leadership Story (a finalist in the Business Book Awards), creator of the REAL leadership model, and an executive coach who has spent years working with leaders at Microsoft, Goldman Sachs, and the Ministry of Defence. Deborah and Paul dig into the real difference between management and leadership: management keeps the wheels turning, leadership gives people something to believe in. She talks about why growth is about what you do, but scaling past a ceiling is about who you are, and why so many founders hit an $18-20m plateau and go looking for a new strategy when what they actually need is to become a different kind of leader. Deborah also shares her own story. An idyllic childhood in Hong Kong that ended abruptly when her parents split up when she was 11. Eight schools and three boarding houses by the time she was 18. A stint as a clapper loader on Sofia Coppola's first film before she trained as a psychotherapist and hypnotherapist and spent years working in addiction recovery. She talks openly about a late miscarriage that stopped her sense of the future in its tracks, the mantra "presence in the present" that carried her through it, and the moment her husband finally believed she'd written a book, because he didn't quite trust it until he was holding it. Paul and Deborah talk about the difference between intention and expectation, why founders need everyone pulling in the same direction (what Deborah calls aligned ambition), why hustle culture is really a dopamine addiction, and why the people you spend the most time with shape your habits and your ceiling more than any strategy will. What you'll learn: The real difference between management and leadership, and why one keeps you small. Why growth is about what you do, but scaling past a ceiling is about who you are. Deborah's REAL leadership model: Results, Emotional intelligence, Authenticity, Legacy. Why intention and expectation aren't the same, and how closing the gap predicts whether you'll hit your goals. How releasing your bottom 20% of clients can 4x revenue by creating space for better ones. Why hustle culture is a dopamine addiction, and why letting go of tactical wins is the hardest part of scaling. Why most businesses stall when the founder stops investing in their own growth, not when the market turns. How growing up across eight schools shaped Deborah's adaptability, and where adapting tips into losing yourself. Why she trained as a psychotherapist and hypnotherapist and spent years working in addiction recovery. Why the five people you spend the most time with define your results more than any strategy. Why retreats accelerate growth: nature, community, distance from your usual stories, and dropping the armour. Why leaders should ask "who needs me to show up as my best self today?" every morning. Why authenticity, not perfection, is what makes a leader trustworthy. Why the leaders who stand out now are the ones willing to be real, in a world that's getting more automated by the day. Apply this: Ask what result you intend and expect for the day, not just what you're hoping for. Build a leadership team before you hit $10-15m, not after. Audit your bottom 20% of clients and create space for better ones to show up. Have the uncomfortable conversation now, you're usually only a few of them away from a lighter business. Spend deliberate time around people playing a bigger game than you. Get comfortable being present instead of chasing the next dopamine hit. Choose your own game, scale and exit or build and lifestyle, and stop measuring yourself against people playing a different one. About Deborah Henley Deborah Henley is a leadership and executive coach, author of Your Leadership Story (a Business Book Awards finalist), and creator of the Real Leadership Program and the REAL leadership model. She has coached senior leaders at Microsoft, Goldman Sachs, and the Ministry of Defence, and draws on more than 20 years across clinical psychology, hypnotherapy, and NLP. She also hosts the podcast Perfectly Flawed. Connect with Deborah on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/deborah-henley/ Scale with Paul Avins If this episode resonated, Paul's work focuses on helping founders step out of the day to day and scale with structure and confidence. Connect with Paul: https://www.linkedin.com/in/paulavins/ Book a call with Paul: https://www.paulavins.com/book-a-call Subscribe to the Scale Up Newsletter: https://www.paulavins.com/newsletter-opt-in Level Up. Team Up. Scale Up. Fire Up.

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  Episode #29

  From Council Estate to £80M Exit: 7-Year Journey to Retiring at 37

  Jul 24, 20262h 2mS2

  What if the biggest barrier to building a multimillion pound business isn't talent or strategy, but your willingness to go all in, hire the right people, and build a culture that makes people want to stay? In this episode, Paul Avins sits down with Andrew Hulbert, a former council estate kid who started a facilities management business from his bedroom, scaled it to over £50 million in turnover with 550 staff, and exited for £80 million at age 37. Andrew shares his journey from earning £8 a week stuffing newspapers at age eight, to director at 24, to starting Pareto FM at 27 and growing it through two exits. A private equity deal let him take money off the table, pay off his mortgage, buy his parents and sisters houses, and give his dad £250,000 to retire early. He explains why he built a personal brand before it was a thing, how winning 50 awards opened doors to multimillion pound contracts, why he hired mums on flexible contracts as his secret weapon, and why he gave away 20% of the business in sweet equity to a management team of 15 who never left. Paul and Andrew explore hitting an organic ceiling at £18 million, realising the business was worth three times what he thought, working with a psychologist for two years before exiting to prepare for sudden wealth syndrome, and building a "social heart" business in a sector that had lost touch with people. Andrew also opens up on the cost of going all in: the strain on his marriage, the 1000-day countdown he put on the wall to keep his promise to his wife, and the £25,000 he spent on donuts in one year to win contracts. What you'll learn: • Why Andrew started earning money at age eight and how working class values shaped his path. • How he became a director at 24 and why a mentor changed everything. • Why he started Pareto FM at 27, spotting that big businesses were terrible at serving small customers. • How he won his first contract with Bulgari Hotel through relationship building. • Why he built a personal brand early through articles, awards, and relentless networking. How he scaled from £1.2m to £18m in six years and hit an organic growth ceiling. • The moment he realised his business was worth £20m, not £6m. • Why he sold to private equity instead of trade, taking money off the table to secure his family. • How investing £1m into overhead took him from £18m to £32m in one year. • Why hiring Bill as his first serious hire freed him to focus on sales and ops. • How giving away 20% in sweet equity to 15 senior leaders kept every one of them for 10 years. • Why hiring mums on flexible contracts built loyalty and cut turnover. How he built a movement around social value in facilities management. • Why he spent £25,000 on donuts in 2019, and how small gestures built unbreakable culture. How working with a psychologist for two years prepared him for life after the sale. • Why he put a 1000-day countdown on the wall and promised his wife he'd retire at 37. How he answered 854 due diligence questions in three and a half weeks. • Why he hired an entire hotel on Christmas Day for 75 family members after the sale. • The cost of going all in, and why his wife Heather is the hero of the story. Apply this: Spend your 20s learning skills, not chasing money — go work for a fast growth company first. Build your personal brand before you need it: articles, awards, relentless networking. Hire for trust and cultural fit, not just skills, especially for senior roles. Invest in overhead when you hit a ceiling — sometimes a million pounds unlocks the next level. Give away equity to the people who matter; sweet equity creates loyalty and alignment. Work with a psychologist before you exit to prepare for sudden wealth syndrome and identity shift. Set a get-out date — without one, the business takes you hostage. About Andrew Hulbert Andrew Hulbert started Pareto FM from his bedroom at 27, scaled it to over £50 million in turnover with 550 staff, and exited for £80 million at 37. He grew up on a council estate in Oxford, became a director at 24, and built a business that won over 50 awards by putting people and social impact at its heart. He's now a business coach, podcaster, and advocate for social value in business. Connect with Andrew on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewhulbert/ Scale with Paul Avins If this episode resonated, Paul's work focuses on helping founders step out of the day to day and scale with structure and confidence. Connect with Paul: https://www.linkedin.com/in/paulavins/ Book a call with Paul: https://www.paulavins.com/book-a-call Subscribe to the Scale Up Newsletter: https://www.paulavins.com/newsletter-opt-in Level Up. Team Up. Scale Up. Fire Up.

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  Episode #27

  Scale Sales with YouTube Ads in 90 Days (Without Wasting Budget)

  Jun 20, 20261h 46mS2

  What if the secret to scaling your sales in the next 90 days isn't working harder or hiring more salespeople, but mastering one platform most business owners completely overlook? In this episode of The Grown UP Business Podcast, Paul Avins sits down with Tom Breeze, founder and CEO of Viewability, a specialist video advertising agency that has managed multi million pound ad budgets for brands like HelloFresh, Mindvalley, ClickFunnels, and Performance Golf. Tom has spent over 13 years running YouTube ads, managing spends of up to £100,000 a day, and has just written the definitive guide to YouTube advertising. This conversation goes deep into why YouTube is the highest quality traffic source available, how the advertising landscape has completely changed in the last three years, and why creative is now 80% of your success. Paul and Tom unpack the psychology behind high performing ads, the five A framework that makes advertising work on any platform, why most entrepreneurs waste budget by skipping the fundamentals, and how to get started with as little as $5 a day. Tom explains why video is no longer optional if you want to scale, how to engineer spontaneity in your content, the difference between YouTube and Meta advertising, and why most agencies get it completely wrong. If you want to scale sales predictably, reduce your cost per acquisition, and build a marketing engine that works without you, this episode is essential. What you'll learn: • Why YouTube delivers the highest quality leads of any advertising platform • How Tom went from helping people overcome fear of public speaking to running a multi million pound ad agency • Why Google AdWords with a £30 voucher changed the trajectory of his first business • The five A framework: Aims, Acquisition, Account, Audience, and Ads • How the algorithm has shifted from manual control to AI driven placement and what that means for advertisers • Why ads with whiteboards, flip charts, or visual demonstrations massively outperform talking head videos • How video disqualifies bad leads and attracts only high intent buyers • How to get started with YouTube ads for as little as $5 a day using in feed video ads • Why you need five conversions a day in your ad account for the algorithm to learn effectively • How to target by postcode, audience behavior, and interest without over narrowing your reach • The difference between YouTube and Meta advertising and why platform specific expertise matters • How video collapses the sales cycle and reduces the skill level required from your sales team • Why most businesses fail at ads because they skip the financial modeling and customer journey mapping • How to test small, learn fast, refine, and scale without breaking the bank • Why the first video you create will suck and why that's actually good news • How to use the circle of excellence technique from NLP to mentally prepare before going on camera • Why authenticity and spontaneity in ads outperform polished scripted content every time Apply this: Map out your customer acquisition model on paper before you spend a single pound on ads. Know your cost per lead, cost per show, cost per sale, and lifetime value. Start with $5 a day running in feed video ads on YouTube targeting a specific audience with one piece of content you already have. Test the waters without breaking the bank. Create a pen and paper style ad where you diagram out your framework or solution on camera in a spontaneous authentic way. Film it handheld or with minimal production and test it. Upload your customer email list to your YouTube ad account to help the algorithm learn who your ideal buyers are and build lookalike audiences. About Tom Breeze Tom Breeze is the founder and CEO of Viewability, a specialist video advertising agency focused on YouTube and Meta. He has managed multi million pound ad budgets for brands including HelloFresh, Mindvalley, ClickFunnels, vShred, and Performance Golf, with ad spends of up to £100,000 a day on YouTube. Tom has over 13 years of experience in video advertising and has worked with major training platforms like Google and Digital Marketer. He is the author of the definitive guide to YouTube ads and helps entrepreneurs and business owners scale sales predictably using video advertising. Connect with Tom on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tombreeze/ Visit Viewability: https://www.viewability.co.uk Get the book on Amazon: Search for Tom Breeze YouTube Ads Scale with Paul Avins If this episode resonated, Paul's work focuses on helping founders step out of the day to day and scale with structure and confidence. Connect with Paul: https://www.linkedin.com/in/paulavins/ Book a call with Paul: https://www.paulavins.com/book-a-call Subscribe to the Scale Up Newsletter: https://www.paulavins.com/newsletter-opt-in Level Up. Team Up. Scale Up. Fire Up.

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  The Grown UP Business Podcast

  McDonald's Systems Expert Marianne Page Reveals the 4 Systems Every Business Needs to Scale

  Jun 19, 202634 minS1

  What if the secret to scaling your business isn't working harder — but building the right systems in the right order? In this episode of The Grown Up Business Podcast, Paul Avins is joined by Marianne Page — systems expert, former McDonald's executive with 27 years' experience, and author of three books on building scalable, repeatable business operations. Marianne shares how McDonald's opened a new restaurant every seven days in the 1980s using a blueprint that trained teams, ensured consistency, and scaled without chaos. Together, Paul and Marianne unpack the four critical system categories every business needs to scale successfully — and why most founders invest 60% of their energy in the wrong one. From sexy systems (marketing and sales) to security systems (finance and data), service systems (operational delivery), and the often-forgotten sticky systems (hiring, training, and feedback) — this conversation reveals why businesses that scale sustainably don't just systemise their operations, they systemise their people. This episode is essential listening for founders and CEOs who want to stop firefighting, build a business that runs without them, and create real enterprise value through disciplined execution. Key Takeaways The four system categories every scalable business needs: Sexy, Security, Service, and Sticky Why most businesses over-invest in marketing and under-invest in people systems How McDonald's scaled by creating a blueprint that made following systems non-negotiable Why sticky systems (hiring, training, feedback) are the foundation of consistency and scale Why most SOPs fail — and how to make your team actually follow them How to shift recruitment from reactive hiring to always-on talent marketing Why investing in developing internal talent beats external hiring for long-term scale The difference between performance management and coaching — and why feedback is a gift, not a punishment Why entrepreneurs resist investing in people — and how to overcome short-term thinking About the Guest Marianne Page is a systems and operations expert with 27 years' experience at McDonald's, where she worked across multiple functions and saw first-hand how disciplined systems enable explosive growth. She is the author of three books: Process to Profit, Simple, Logical, Repeatable, and Mission to Manage. Marianne specializes in helping established businesses scale by building sticky systems that ensure consistency, operational excellence, and sustainable growth. She works with businesses from £500k to £30 million in revenue. Next Steps Apply it now Identify which of the four systems (Sexy, Security, Service, Sticky) you're neglecting — and commit to one action this week to strengthen it. Connect with Marianne Page LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram: Marianne Page Books available on Amazon: Process to Profit, Simple, Logical, Repeatable, Mission to Manage Scale with Paul If this episode resonated, Paul's work focuses on helping founders step out of the day-to-day and scale with structure and confidence. Book a call with Paul: https://www.paulavins.com/book-a-call Subscribe to the Scale-Up Newsletter: https://www.paulavins.com/newsletter-opt-in About Paul Avins Paul Avins is a scale-up business coach and founder of the Grown-Up Business framework. He works with founders and CEOs to help them move from operator to scale-up leader — building businesses that grow sustainably, scale beyond the founder, and create real enterprise value. Paul's work focuses on disciplined leadership, high-performing teams, and systems that replace chaos with clarity. Level Up. Team Up. Scale Up. Fire Up.

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  Episode #26

  [REVEALED] How Private Equity Turns £15M Businesses Into £50M Exits with Nick Bradley

  Jun 6, 20262h 13mS2

  What if the secret to scaling from £15M to £50M wasn't working harder, but thinking like a private equity firm? In this episode of The Grown UP Business Podcast, Paul Avins sits down with Nick Bradley, private equity strategist, former operating partner, and author of Exit For Millions. Nick has been involved in over 50 acquisitions and 27 business exits worth over £5 billion. He pulls back the curtain on how private equity firms 10X business valuations and reveals the exact strategies entrepreneurs can use to build investor grade companies, whether they plan to sell or not. This conversation goes deep. Nick shares his journey from News International to Getty Images, working inside some of the most elite private equity firms in the world, including Blackstone. He explains what private equity really is, how deals are structured, why most businesses never sell, and the five value creation levers PE firms use to transform undervalued businesses into eight and nine figure exits. Paul and Nick unpack the private equity playbook, including the 100 day plan, the ultimate CEO dashboard with just five metrics that actually matter, the 15 fatal flaws that kill deals, and why most entrepreneurs rush the exit process without understanding the game they're playing. Nick also opens up about why he left private equity, the unresolved trauma entrepreneurs carry, and how his father's death became the catalyst for building a business that helps founders exit on their terms. If you're building a business and want to understand how to create real enterprise value, this episode is essential. What you'll learn: • What private equity really is and how it works behind the scenes • The two key metrics private equity obsesses over: MOIC and IRR • How private equity firms are trained like special forces to make clinical decisions under pressure • The five value creation levers PE firms use: revenue growth, margin expansion, capital structuring, acquisitions, and value expansion • The 100 day plan: how PE firms strengthen foundations and create momentum fast • The 15 fatal flaws that stop businesses from selling to private equity • Why most entrepreneurs don't build a board and how a mini mastermind can accelerate growth and increase valuation • Simplicity at scale: how private equity runs board meetings with a one page business review Apply this: Ask yourself: what is my life changing number? Why does it matter? And is what I'm doing now going to get me there? Start tracking the five CEO dashboard metrics every Monday morning: cash runway, EBITDA margin, revenue growth rate, pipeline coverage, and customer concentration. Audit your business against the 15 reasons why businesses don't sell. Identify the top three gaps and commit to fixing them in the next 12 to 18 months. Build a board or advisory group. Start with one person who will challenge you, support you, and help you see what you can't see on your own. About Nick Bradley Nick Bradley is a private equity strategist, former operating partner, and founder of the Scale Up podcast. He has been involved in over 50 acquisitions and 27 business exits worth over £5 billion. Nick now helps founders build investor grade businesses and exit for millions using the private equity playbook. His new book, Exit For Millions: The Private Equity Blueprint for Scaling and Selling Your Business for Maximum Value, is available now. Connect with Nick https://www.linkedin.com/in/realnickbradley Listen to the Scale Up podcast and grab a copy of Exit For Millions Scale with Paul Avins If this episode resonated, Paul's work focuses on helping founders step out of the day to day and scale with structure and confidence. Connect with Paul: https://www.linkedin.com/in/paulavins/ Book a call with Paul: https://www.paulavins.com/book-a-call Subscribe to the Scale Up Newsletter: https://www.paulavins.com/newsletter-opt-in Level Up. Team Up. Scale Up. Fire Up.

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