The Innovative Investor Podcast: Property Debt Wealth in the Modern Era
Post-Pung Tax Lien Strategies with Matt Abee of Nelson Mullins Riley & Scarborough — Part 2
In this episode of The Innovative Investor Podcast, Stephen speaks with Matt Abee, a partner at Nelson Mullins Riley & Scarborough, about the Supreme Court’s recent ruling in Pung v. Isabella County and what it means for anyone investing in tax liens, tax deeds or other distressed real-estate debt. As part two of the deep dive, they revisit the legal drama that nearly upended the industry, unpack Matt’s immediate reactions to the opinion, and explore how the Court’s emphasis on “fairly conducted” tax sales creates new landmines, and opportunities, for investors. Along the way, Stephen and Matt compare Pung to landmark cases like Tyler, break down when just compensation must be measured by surplus proceeds versus full fair-market value, and explain why online auctions and clear public notice will soon be as critical as the lien bid itself. Matt walks us through the baseline rule that still protects the vast majority of properly handled sales, plus the exceptional circumstances that could trigger surplus-based takings claims under 42 U.S.C. § 1983. He offers a concise playbook for tomorrow’s investor: revisit recent portfolios, shore up notice and sale procedures, lean on robust auction platforms, and enlist local counsel before chasing rock-bottom bids. Whether you’re scaling a national tax-lien fund or making your first out-of-state purchase, this episode will help you measure and manage your risk in a post-Pung world. Timestamps Initial industry reaction and mixed feelings about the Pung ruling – 02:38 Plain-English breakdown of SCOTUS’s just-compensation decision (surplus vs. fair market value) – 05:12 Unanswered questions on what makes a tax sale “fairly conducted” – 07:47 Investor takeaways: assessing risk, doing due diligence, and portfolio review – 18:24 State-by-state safe-haven strategies for tax-sale investing post-Pung – 25:41 Get in Touch with Stephen and Matt Abee Website: https://jurisdeed.com/ Waitlist: https://jurisdeed.com/waitlist Stephen's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stephenmorel-jd/ Matt's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matthew-a-abee-3631832b/ Nelson Mullins: https://www.nelsonmullins.com/ Cases Mentioned Pung v. Isabella: https://www.nelsonmullins.com/insights/alerts/additional_nelson_mullins_alerts/all/u-s-supreme-court-hears-arguments-in-pung-v-isabella-county Tyler v. Hennepin County: https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/22pdf/22-166_8n59.pdf Mennonite Board of Missions v. Adams: https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/462/791 And if you love the show, subscribe to follow it! If you're investing in Louisiana tax sales under the 2026 rules, you need legal and asset management partners who specialize in this niche: Quiet Title Litigation – TDLG (Tax Deed Legal Group) After your redemption period expires, TDLG forecloses your lien so you can recover your investment with confidence. Louisiana-licensed attorneys with deep expertise in tax sale law handle all litigation, notice requirements, and foreclosure proceedings. Website: www.taxdeedlegal.com Email: info@taxdeedlegal.com Asset Liquidation & Management – DeedWolf Holding an unredeemed lien... Chapters (00:00:00) - Should You Care About Tax Liens? (00:01:41) - The Tax Liens Argument (00:03:06) - More Litigation on Tax Lien Sales? (00:05:46) - Supreme Court: Just Compensation and Fair Market Value (00:09:56) - When Do You Value a Tax Sale Property? (00:13:00) - On the Takings of Property (00:15:26) - Top Lawmakers: Property Rights Ruling (00:18:29) - Does Pong Impact Property Tax Sales? (00:20:03) - Do You Have Personal Liability For Tax Liability? (00:25:12) - Tax Liens and Tyler and Pung (00:27:52) - Probable Cause: Fair Tax Sale Cases (00:33:20) - Pung Impact on Property Sales & Investment (00:36:26) - Tax Liens: Where Would I Put My Money? (00:45:00) - The Pong Case: What's the Closing Line of Real (00:46:50) - Tax Liens: Where the Money Is in the Industry
